Wednesday, January 21, 2009

Book Club: Outrageous People

Here's the spot for Candide! It's the best of all possible spots....

34 Comments:

At 9:04 PM, Blogger jma said...

What do you think is the significance of Dr. Pangloss's teachings?

He's always teaching Candide "all is for the best in this world," (24) and in all the situations that he's found himself in, he seems to keep that saying at heart, and keep his optimism up. However, not only has that saying kept his optimism up, but also brought him into dangerous situations (getting swept in with the Bulgarians)

So, what do you guys think? Do you agree with this saying? Or do you think Candide trusts the good in the world a little too much?

 
At 9:25 PM, Blogger jma said...

Also, I'd like to point out a humorous part of the chapters that made me smile. The part where Pangloss describes how he contracted syphilis is pretty unfortunate, but quite funny at the same time.

"It was a present given to her by a learned Franciscan friar who had derived it from the point of origin, for it was given to him by an old countess, who received it from a cavalry captain, who owed it to a marquise, who got it from a page, who was given it by a Jesuit who, while still a novice had received it in direct line from a shipmate of Christopher Columbus." (26)

I think Voltaire's technique of prolonging the list of people who contracted it is what makes this passage funny. Though unfortunate, but still funny. Also, the fact that he calls it a little 'present', adds the sarcasm to the quote, also adding to the funny.

Any other parts of these chapters you guys thought were funny?

 
At 10:17 PM, Blogger Victor Banor said...

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At 10:42 PM, Blogger Victor Banor said...

Candide is riddled with subtle humor. Chapter II for example--the segment where Candide is in the Bulgarian army, He is

“Bewildered, and could not see how he was a hero [and defender of the Bulgarian people]. One fine spring day he decided to go for a walk—acting on the principal that human beings, like animals, have the right to use their legs as they wish. He hadn’t gone very far before he was overtaken by four other heroes (comrades). At the court-martial, he is given the option, “run the gauntlet thirty-six times through the whole regiment or to have his skull split by a doze bullets. It was no use his saying that he didn’t want either. He had to choose; so he exercised that divine gift known as ‘Free Will’ by choosing to run the gauntlet thirty-six times”(Voltaire 22).

In this section, Voltaire examines the idea of 'Free Will' and through Candide’s naivety of being swept into a battle he knew nothing of provides the subtle humor, especially the line, “it was no use his saying that he didn’t want either”(Voltaire 22).

 
At 4:04 AM, Blogger Victor Banor said...

Dr. Pangloss is an individual who wholly believes in his philosophy, “everything is for the best”. But, as Jessica mentioned, this phrase has “brought him into dangerous situations” and has left him with the pox, made him depressed, along with being penniless (having to resort to begging). How is everything for the best then, when the heart of man in this world is savage? The minor characters in the story for example, are cold hearted. When Candide arrives in Holland, he expects to be well treated because “everyone in this land was rich” and begs the “substantial looking citizens” but they dismiss him. He is also dismissed by an orator who not so long ago, gave a speech on charity, which is ironic. The orator says, “Thou dost not deserve to eat” because Candide did not believe or understand whether or not the Pope was the Anti-Christ. This is ironic because charity is a blind act and impartial love (in the Christian virtue) to help people who are in need, which Candide clearly is. I saw this act of intolerance as greater than the small act of kindness Candide receives from the Anabaptist who rescues him. Candide says, “Everything is for the best. ‘Tis plainly so, for I am much more affected by your generosity than I was by the harshness of the gentlemen and his wife, [who have humiliated me]”(Voltaire 24). At the early stage of the book Candide also wholly believes in his master's words but I predict that as greater acts of intolerance are exposed and seen by Candide, the more his heart will sway back and forth from whether or not the words are true.

 
At 5:37 AM, Blogger Paul_In_A_Nutshell said...

Responding to Jessica's first post, I would have to personally disagree with that comment. But also there is a simplicity to that saying. I feel like it's a frame of mind. It works for Candide as he seems truly happy (though maybe later he might break down or something.) It's interesting though how fortune seems to be always of Candide's side as he survives a shipwreck and thieves plundering the village, so he must be doing something right. Then again despite the fact that he does survive, it is only after very hash beatings or injuries mental and physical. He then goes back for more... which I think is the satire as Candide is portrayed as someone, though intelligent, who cannot learn anything new because he is too stubborn and even perhaps a bit unintentionally stuck up. Candide can also be a satire about being truly happy, and what defines this happiness.

 
At 10:23 PM, Blogger Paul_In_A_Nutshell said...

I also want to point out one of the biggest flaws of Pongloss' philosophy. He bases his optimism off his philosophy despite the facts surrounding him in the real world. It causes him and also any person who follows this philosophy harm and prevents them from simply allowing themselves out of adverse situation. He allows Jacques to drown as he claims that the ocean is made for him to drowned in. He lets another die in the earthquake because the earthquake was made to kill that person. wth. This philosophy seems to advocate laziness. I could easily use this philosophy and say that I'm not doing english homework because it this class was taken by me so I can fail.

 
At 11:08 PM, Blogger Paul_In_A_Nutshell said...

I have to agree with Victor's prediction that Candide will eventually reject Pangoss' philosophy. On another note I found it very interesting that when Candide meets Pangoss again after being kicked out, Pangoss is blind and very sick which might hint at how wrong and adverse his philosophy is. His philosophy seems empty because it doesn't really do anything. Even though he claims that everything is for the best, his explanations are absurd and doesn't really help explain anything. I particularly like how he tried to explain that syphilis must be transfered by Americans to Europeans so they can enjoy delicacies such as chocolate. I don't think there's any correlation between chocolate and syphilis. If there is, they can keep their syphilis chocolates then...

 
At 12:34 AM, Blogger Victor Banor said...

Voltaire also presents clashing philosophies, for example the Anabaptists philosophy of human nature,

“Men must have deviated from their original innocence, they were not born wolves, but they’ve become wolves: God didn’t give them twenty-four pounders or bayonets, but they’ve made themselves bayonets and cannons with which to destroy each other. I might also mention bankruptcies, and the law which takes over a bankrupt’s property to defraud his creditors of it”(Voltaire 27).

The Anabaptist’s views shed a negative light on man and his cravings for war, power and exploitation of one another. Pangloss replies that this truth is “indispensable” for an individual’s misfortunes “create general welfare, so that the more individual misfortunes there are, the more all is well”(Voltaire 28). Pangloss’s thoughts mirror his views that “all is for the best in this world,” even the universal suffering of others. This frame of mind may work for himself and Candide but nonetheless, is a cruel statement.

 
At 11:33 AM, Blogger jma said...

I agree with Paul's comment on how Pangloss's philosophy seems to just promote laziness. And it's going to be interesting to see how Candide's opinion of it will either change or he'll stick to it.

If Candide chooses to change his opinion and reject Pangloss's theory, it could be Voltaire's purpose of telling society to be more proactive in your fate. Or, if he chooses to stick with it, it would be a satiric symbol of how society will always be ignorant and lazy.

 
At 10:35 AM, Blogger Ms. Clapp said...

Time for round two...

 
At 3:32 PM, Blogger jma said...

I just wanted to bring up chapter 10, when Cunegonde realized her jewels were missing, Candide brings up another one of Pangloss's philosophy.

"...the goods of this world are common to all men, that everyone has an equal right to them"(40)

And once again, we see the flaws in Pangloss's teachings. Candide, "acting on that principle", believes the Franciscan would have left enough for them to continue on their journey, but he didn't even leave them 'a penny'. Also, the fact that it was a "reverend Franciscan", puts an ironic twist in this situation. I think this was Voltaire's way of criticizing society, that all men are greedy, even if they're religious.

 
At 4:45 PM, Blogger Victor Banor said...

In chapter 6, after the Lisbon earthquake, rather than to mourn the dead, the “wise men” could see no better way of lifting the spirits of the peoples up by giving them an auto-de-fe, which is ironic. I was unclear of what an auto-de- fé was, but it was, "act of faith," e.g. public execution. Voltaire writes, “it was decided [by the educated mass] that the sight of several people being slowly burned with great ceremony was an infallible means of preventing the earth from quaking”(Voltaire 31). Voltaire I believe added this to illustrate the ridiculous belief of this time period. It’s both ironic and ridiculous for these individuals to believe that destruction could be avoided by further destruction and degradation of others. Leonard Bernstein composed and produced a musical adaptation in 1956, featuring a song called "Auto-da-Fé" which included the chorus line "It's a lovely day for drinking and for watching people die," again the irony and humor, sick humor of course, I don’t get off on watching people burn. But relating this back to what Jessica said, this is again an example of different doctrines and beliefs in this backwards society (depending on your own views). Also Voltaire wrote Candide, during the Enlightenment period, an age of reason and I believe along with his intent to satire this period, this example can also relate back to a more modern view of the world, as Ms. Clapp suggested we think about. No matter what time period, when the future looks back on the past, they’ll believe that we were irrational morons, just as we believe or are presented with in Candide, a society full of irrational morons.

 
At 8:37 PM, Blogger Paul_In_A_Nutshell said...

It's very interesting to see the old lady who reunites Candide and his love to have gone through adversity equal to that of Candide and Conegonde, but act completely modest even so. She uses it to instead to teach that everyone goes through what Candide and Conegonde has gone through at some point and basically suggest for them to quit their complaining. This is further emphasized as ever person on the boat had a story of adversity to share with the two. This in large retrospect of things reveals that bad luck is an integral part of any persons life, and should be dealt with by overcoming it, not ignoring it.

I found it peculiar that Candide easily killed Conegonde's two suitors swiftly, yet acts very timid and humble at other times. Does this somehow point out a flaw in him as well as the philosophy he follows?

 
At 10:02 PM, Blogger Paul_In_A_Nutshell said...

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At 10:03 PM, Blogger Paul_In_A_Nutshell said...

I'm going to have to disagree with your last Victor's comment that the future looks back at the ideas and people of the past as morons. Instead, I think that it's quite the opposite. We build from the ideas of the past. I agree, however, that perhaps Voltaire criticizes the hypocrisy of modern society as one that uses the ideas of the past but at the same time criticizes them to be obsolete. Or even how dogmatic everyone seems to be as no person is able to consider another's point of view or philosophy as exemplified by Candide, Conegonde, and Pangloss - and by being so dogmatic, they are unable to achieve happiness and enlightenment that they so sought.

 
At 11:20 PM, Blogger jma said...

I found that quote you were talking about, Paul.

"I've grown old in poverty and shame, with only half a behind, always remembering that I'm a pope's daughter. I've wanted to kill myself a hundred times, but I still love life. That ridiculous weakness is perhaps one of our most pernicious inclinations. What could be more stupid than to persist in carrying a burden that we constantly want to cast off, to hold our existence in horror, yet cling to it nonetheless, to fondle the serpent that devours us, until it has eaten our hearts?"(49)

This was probably one of the passages that stuck out most in my mind. The message is exactly what Paul said: "everyone goes through what Candide and Conegonde has gone through at some point and basically suggest for them to quit their complaining."

When Voltaire puts in this paragraph, after chapters and chapters of horrifying stories of the old woman's past, it's almost like a shimmer of hope. There's no use in looking back at the past in shame, or unhappiness. I think the fact that she was able to carry on is why she was so modest about explaining all of this. And the reason for enduring all of this; her reason is that she 'loved life'.

 
At 11:27 PM, Blogger Victor Banor said...

I’d like to disagree with Paul’s comment about the old woman reuniting Candide and Cunegonde and “acting completely modest”. Yes, she does indeed teach them both a lesson that human beings naturally are inclined to having feelings of death when misfortunes hit them but I read the old woman’s story as definitely being exaggerated. Both Cunegonde and the old woman are guilty of this. Cunegonde says, “unless you had been ravished by two Bulgarians, had received two deep wounds in your belly, had seen two of your own castles demolished, had lost two fathers, and two mothers, and seen both of them barbarously murdered before your eyes, and to sum up all, had two lovers whipped at an auto-da-fe, I cannot see how you could be more unfortunate than I. Add to this, though born a baroness, and bearing seventy-two quarterings, I have been reduced to the station of a cook-wench."(Voltaire 41). Cunegonde’s tone is boastful, as in saying, “I’ve seen more misfortunes than you have, so don’t even talk to me” -snap snap-. To summarize the old woman’s story, it was basically the same thing, but she was ravished more. Another issue that I had with both stories was their boastful tone about being ravished so much and traded. So why does Voltaire add this? (We’ll discuss this further in class tomorrow).

 
At 11:41 PM, Blogger jma said...

Well, trying to relate this book to modern times, I'd say he was trying to criticize religion. The fact that the old lady was a daughter of the pope...Aren't popes supposed to refrain from sex? Obviously, in order to be his daughter, he must have committed some kind of sin. So, Voltaire is most likely taking a stab at the church. The fact that the highest member of religion, the pope, is having sex(which was a nono) is to show how hypocritical the church is.

Also, I think I'd have to agree with Victor on how "the future looks back on the past, they’ll believe that we were irrational morons", although Paul's comment on "We build from the ideas of the past." is true also. The Enlightenment was also a time of science and philosophy, and among those ideas, there was definitely some philosophical ideas that were very much flawed. (such as Pangloss's teachings) And I think that Voltaire was trying to criticize these ideas as well.

 
At 11:43 PM, Blogger jma said...

And random note, I thought the fact that the old lady was walking around with half a butt was very humorous. Sick...yes. Very sick. But..She's got half a butt!

 
At 11:46 PM, Blogger Victor Banor said...

In chapter 13, Voltaire illustrates the inconsistency in Candide’s New World belief of new beginnings. Just as in the Old World, Candide manages to bounce himself into another trouble. That aside, Voltaire doesn’t just focus on Candide’s story, at the same time; he discusses the themes of the period. For example, in the New World, the Europeans have taken advantage of the native peoples. Voltaire writes, “they conducted Candide to a beautiful pavilion adomed with a colonnade of green marble, spotted with yellow, and with an intertexture of vines, which served as a kind of cage for parrots, humming birds, guinea hens, and all other curious kinds of birds. An excellent breakfast was provided in vessels of gold; and while the Paraguayans were eating coarse Indian corn out of wooden dishes in the open air, and exposed to the burning heat of the sun, the Reverend Father Commandant retired to his cool arbor.”(Voltaire 54). The native Americans are exploited at the expense of the Europeans, who live in luxury, whilst their considered uncivilized counterparts live in poverty.

 
At 11:49 PM, Blogger jma said...

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At 11:50 PM, Blogger jma said...

To Victor, I'm not so sure the tone was very 'boastful'; I didn't really seem to sense any tone of that sort, actually. However, I think the repetition of being 'ravished' and traded so often is to exaggerate the evils of mankind, and thus, is another jab at Pangloss's philosophy, or any kind of overtly optimistic philosophy. But yes, we will talk about this more in class. =]

 
At 12:09 AM, Blogger Victor Banor said...

Haha half a butt.

I agree that the repetition of "ravished" entails your opinion that Voltaire again "jabs at Pangloss's philosophy, or any kind of overtly optimistic philosophy, but the list after list she provides also led me to believe that she has indeed overcome her past, because she says that it strengthens the virtues of a young girl. Unlike Cunegonde who can only complain.

 
At 7:51 AM, Blogger Paul_In_A_Nutshell said...

I've somewhat changed my mind. I would have to say that both Cunegonde and the old lady have a boastful tone, but I feel that they both have different motives for the boasting. Cunegonde and Candide do it to gain sympathy and support each other by showing how much they have gone through for the other, while the old lady uses this boastful tone to teach a lesson and make serve as a reminder to herself and others what she has been through. Anyways we'll talk...

 
At 7:36 PM, Blogger Victor Banor said...

In a curious and puzzled tone, Candide asks, “What sort of a country is this, that is unknown to all the world; and in which Nature has everywhere so different an appearance to what she has in ours? Possibly this is that part of the globe where everywhere is right, for there must certainly be some such place. And, for all that Master Pangloss could say, I often perceived that things went very ill in Westphalia." (65)

I thought it was interesting when he says, “I often perceived that things went very ill in Westphalia.” My mouth literally opened wide because this demonstrates that Candide, the bouncy character that he is, is blind to the happenings and what has happened to him. The war is obvious evidence enough that things “went very ill in Westphalia” but also the harsh treatment of women and the contempt European society had for one another. Also, his statement is evidence that he followed Pangloss’s ideology like a sheep. However, I feel that Candide again makes a mistake when he says, “possibly this is that part of the globe where everywhere is right, for there must certainly be some such place” because like the old woman earlier said, everyone has their own struggles and this convinces me that these indigenous people also face struggles. Superficially, Candide judges that their city is “right” but digging deep, it may just be the opposite.

 
At 9:29 PM, Blogger Victor Banor said...

Voltaire is definitely providing humor as he describes the room. Voltaire writes, “They entered a very plain house, for the door was nothing but silver, and the ceiling was only of beaten gold, but wrought in such elegant taste as to vie with the richest. The antechamber, indeed, was only incrusted with rubies and emeralds; but the order in which everything was disposed made amends for this great simplicity.” (66) I focused on the words “only” like oh, it was only a gold ceiling and oh it was old a jewel encrusted door! This is definitely Voltaire’s humor shining.

But what is Voltaire trying to achieve? I see what he’s pointing out but I’m having a difficult time getting to the overall meaning.

From what I understand, the isolation of this city prevents the “rapacious” of the Europeans from entering. But is Voltaire suggesting that this society is greater than Europe? With an isolated city, they are left to their own devices and not influenced by outside religion or technology however, they still manage nor seek power.

 
At 11:05 PM, Blogger Paul_In_A_Nutshell said...

It's interesting how money is portrayed in the novel. Ironically, after attaining a fortune in Eldorado, Candide only slides more into adversity and depression which implies that money leads to corruption and destruction. Despite the fact that his money allows him to bride bandits to leave him alone or allow him to obtain anything materialistic he wants. His newfound fortune also seems to attract more false friends such as Vanderdendur who cheats him out of a hefty amount of money. Money is also hinted to be a force of destruction as it disallows Count Pococurante to appreciate his art as well as Brother Giroflee and Paquette to "their last stage of misery" Voltaire perhaps insinuates that it is best to be in the middle rather at either extreme as both poverty and excessive fortune are portrayed as bad and destructive physically and mentally. Any thoughts?

 
At 11:12 PM, Blogger Paul_In_A_Nutshell said...

Answering Victor's question about Voltaire's motives about the not so enthusiastic description of the room. I feel like it connects with my comments about over-excessive money and fortune, which leads to the person losing the ability to appreciate anything since what is usually good fortune to an average joe is an everyday thing to them. I'm not too sure if Voltaire uses this passage to show superiority. If it does, it's probably in an ironic way- something like a false sense of superiority as they don't realize that they are the disadvantaged ones.

 
At 11:33 PM, Blogger jma said...

I’d like to point out a part of irony/satire in the beginning of chapter 14.

When Candide starts to worry about Cunegonde and wondering whether she’d be alright, Cacambo tries to calm him down by telling that that “Women always manage to find something to do with themselves; God looks after them. Let’s go.”(52)

Okay, first of all, “God looks after them”? After all of the raping, and brutality against women in this book that we’ve read so far, I was wondering whether this outrageous sentence was deliberate in order to say something, or is he simply making Cacambo another symbol of that ‘overtly optimistic’ mistake that society makes. Or both? I think maybe he’s trying to, again, criticize the Pangloss philosophy, and by saying things like that, and believing she’ll be ‘fine’, is the same as turning yourself away in ignorance. And maybe, this is also another criticism of religion. By saying God will look after them is just as ignorant, if not more. Obviously God hasn’t been looking over Cunegonde or the old woman for a very long time, and to say that he looks after them now is completely ridiculous.

 
At 11:44 PM, Blogger Victor Banor said...

Voltaire provides consistency with his introduction of new ideologies that deny Pangloss/Candide’s ideology. I found Martin’s negative ideology interesting because rather than to question the value of man, he affirms that man is worthless, greedy and sinful, etc. More and more I read of Martin’s ideology, I started to believe it. Candide asks, “"Do you think, that mankind always massacred one another as they do now? Were they always guilty of lies, fraud, treachery, ingratitude, inconstancy, envy, ambition, and cruelty? Were they always thieves, fools, cowards, gluttons, drunkards, misers, calumniators, debauchees, fanatics, and hypocrites?" and Martin responds, "Do you believe, that hawks have always been accustomed to eat pigeons when they came in their way? if hawks have always had the same nature, why should you pretend that mankind change theirs.

Martin’s ideology suggests that man is not willing to change and although they have free will as Candide makes clear, they are consistent in their attempt to hold one another in contempt. Martin has seen the world and the contempt and cruelty it man possesses for one another. Pangloss’s philosophy from the beginning was too simplistic for me, and doesn’t provide evidence to sway a person into believing it, expect that person as good luck as Candide apparently does. However, Martin’s philosophy, in this time period, I believe is reliable, even though it‘s so negative..

 
At 11:57 PM, Blogger jma said...

To Paul's blog on money, I agree that Voltaire's purpose is to show "money leads to corruption and destruction." However, I think that it's not so much about money, but about greed.

I 'wikipedia-ed' Eldorado, and found that it is a mythical city of gold, and "It is used sometimes as a metaphor to represent something much sought after that may not even exist, or at least may not ever be found." I think that Voltaire's point in this is to show that a place without greed is near impossible, and ‘may not ever be found.’

When Candide tries to pay for his meal in Eldorado with the ‘stones’ from the road, the host just laughed and replied “…Excuse us for laughing when you offered to pay us with two stones from our roads. You probably have none of our money, but you don’t need any to dine here. All inns run for convenience of people…”(65) In a place where money, or anything as precious as gold and gems are considered dirt and stones, greed does not exist. This kind of utopia is Voltaire’s way of saying how greed is the reason why we will never live in a place like Eldorado. Plus, the people of Eldorado choose to live an isolated life because they know that as soon as outsiders, who are naturally filled with greed, will collapse their utopia. It was quite surprising that Candide would want to return back to the poverty-stricken and evil-filled world…any ideas why he would want to do that?

 
At 11:59 PM, Blogger Paul_In_A_Nutshell said...

Ah the Garden at the end of the novel. Allusion to the garden of eden? Yeah, probably. Like the garden of eden, the garden allows Candide to be happy and live in bliss. I saw, however more contrasts to the Garden of eden that similarities. For example, Adam and Even never had to work for their food and their banishment resulted in the beginning (in a way) of mankind while Candide has to work in order to grow the food and also the novel ends with the garden. I feel like this is a modern version of the garden of eden and perhaps also symbolizes the characters choosing to live life and embrace it as the garden is also a place were life (of fruits and vegetables) begins. The garden also perhaps serves as contrast of Pangloss' philosophy as it promotes labor in return for reward rather than going with the flow and reasoning that everything is done for a reason.

 
At 9:09 AM, Blogger jma said...

In response to Victor's comment, I agree that Martin's philosophy is very negative and defitnetly shows a more realistic view on life. In comparison to Pangloss's teachings, Martin's is defitnetly more detailed and in describing the nature of man, Martin certainly makes it obvious that humans can be downright evil. I think Martin's character serves as a foil to Pangloss's character; where Pangloss is the overtly optimistic and Martin is the overlty pessimistic.

However, I do believe it might be too negative. Although everythign that we've seen so far in the book shows the downside of humans, people still hold on to faith. Like the old woman, for example, though she's endured so much, she has the ability to look past it and 'love life'. Martin's theory is extreme pessimistic, while Pangloss's is extreme optomistic. However, Martin's pessimism makes him very unsympathetic to the troubles and despair of other people. "Martin was not very comforting. Candide's melancholy increased, and Martin was constantly proving to him that there was little virtue or happiness in the world, except perhaps in Eldorado, where no one could go." (94) This gloomy outlook on life makes me wonder if one should hate life so much, what's the point in living?

So, in the end, I think Voltaire is suggesting that being too optimistic and being too pessimistic both make you very oblivious to reality, and to find the middle ground in all those theories is the way to go.

 

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